trice

[katlander]

It may make sense to give AT some early minutes before we are in the 1 & 1. The fouls he gets then will not put him on the line unless he is shooting. Getting early fouls on opposing bigs may be worth the free throw challenge. Who knows he may start to hit them. If the coaches just don't want him on the line then just tell him not to shoot it unless he has an open dunk, a bunny or an open 8 footer. Make defense and rebounds his focus. Could really help and keep Mak and Levi out of foul trouble.

[IStillLikeHarv]

It may make sense to give AT some early minutes before we are in the 1 & 1. The fouls he gets then will not put him on the line unless he is shooting. Getting early fouls on opposing bigs may be worth the free throw challenge. Who knows he may start to hit them. If the coaches just don't want him on the line then just tell him not to shoot it unless he has an open dunk, a bunny or an open 8 footer. Make defense and rebounds his focus. Could really help and keep Mak and Levi out of foul trouble.

I actually mentioned this approach in a post during the preseason, but after giving Trice minutes in the early going, the coaches have moved away from him. I assume (as others have suggested) that he has assignment breakdowns on defense that are costing him playing time. He also fumbled the ball much more often in the early going than he did at the JUCO level. It is hard for most of us, and a lot of young players, to understand just what a jump it is to play high major basketball.

I remember a quote from Maurice before he left KSU where he commented on how different things were when he actually got to play at this level after sitting out as a redshirt. He said he couldn't understand why players weren't just dunking the ball down low like they do in high school. Then when he played, he found out how hard it is to jump with a 240 lbs guy leaning on you. It takes some time to make that transition.

[kinsleycat]

Start him against PayU and tell him to muscle up against the Charmin soft Dedric Lawson. See if he's tough enough to take some physical play.

[Kid In the Hall]

Play Stockard over Trice... fine, I suppose. But what do Shadd/Love bring to the table at this point that Trice doesn't? They look just as lost on both ends of the floor and clearly aren't nearly as athletic as Trice. That's the perplexing part.

[xtrawildcat]

Play Stockard over Trice... fine, I suppose. But what do Shadd/Love bring to the table at this point that Trice doesn't? They look just as lost on both ends of the floor and clearly aren't nearly as athletic as Trice. That's the perplexing part.

I watched Shadd play 2 minutes against WVU and have to say I liked what I saw from him more than Stockard. Got one foul called on him but also kept his position against Culver. Culver made one free throw while Shadd was in. I'm sure he has holes in his game or would get more time but to me he shows much more upside than Stockard. And I actually see Trice and Shadd both as guys with more upside than Stockard. However, it will be sorted out over time and maybe Stockard can have a few good games coming down the stretch.

[Jax]

Here is the reality of Trice. If he is being considered a development player for K-State, I don't expect him to be back. Players on this team play tentatively at times, which clearly is a result of having to over think things. It was the same with the football team. That is on the coaching staff if you make things complicated to where a player is hesitating, or do not have enough repetition to where things become second nature. That too is on the coaching style.

I go back to again, whatever Trice's problem that keeps him from getting more playing time was a problem when K-State recruited him. If the coaches thought they could bring him in and develop Trice, then that was silly. I agree with Wazucat, the reason you bring in JUCO players is to fill immediate needs, not to develop.

[Gorhoops]

Here is the reality of Trice. If he is being considered a development player for K-State, I don't expect him to be back. Players on this team play tentatively at times, which clearly is a result of having to over think things. It was the same with the football team. That is on the coaching staff if you make things complicated to where a player is hesitating, or do not have enough repetition to where things become second nature. That too is on the coaching style.

I go back to again, whatever Trice's problem that keeps him from getting more playing time was a problem when K-State recruited him. If the coaches thought they could bring him in and develop Trice, then that was silly. I agree with Wazucat, the reason you bring in JUCO players is to fill immediate needs, not to develop.

Not sure I agree here Jax. I can't imagine that you are saying that a guy should get minutes just because, whether he earns them or not?? 97% or so of all P5 first year players are going to struggle and play tentative. Kansas State is only good this year because we play outstanding defense, and it may be complicated, but it is how we have to play if we want to win. If a guy is going to be a weak spot on defense, he ain't playin,' simple as that. Trice was brought in to address the immediate need of rebounding, and it is quite possible he has done that because rebounding is not a weakness of this team this year, so maybe Mak and other guys finally got the idea that they better rebound because the coaches just brought in a juco guy for the soul purpose to rebound, which would take minutes from the returners. I would argue that sometimes juco guys might be brought in to light a fire under returning players as well, and if those returners get the message and are better, than they play because they have a head start on all other aspects of the program than that juco guy has.

Yes, the general idea is to bring in juco's to fill needs, but if they can't cut, they don't play, simple as that. Happens all the time.

We have six losses this year. Three were a result of the other team really lighting it up, Marquette, Texas (without 2 key guys), and ISU. Two of those losses, Tulsa and A&M, were strictly due to horrible shooting on our part.

The other 20 games we have played, we have won. So tell me, in which of those six losses was Trice going to be the key to the win?? Sure wasn't going to be going out and guarding 3 point shooters like Markus Howard or the ISU guys Saturday or those Texas guards, and it sure wasn't going to be to make shots against Tulsa and A&M's zone.

I guess I just tend to give the coaches a break and say that they know what they are doing. Hard for me to say they should make it less complicated so a guy can play that really wouldn't give us anything we aren't getting from someone else, when we are 20-6 and leading the Big 12 conference race.

[hilltopwildcat]

Gor, I agree with Jax that it seems to me that this staff does try to make everything more complicated. At some point in time Weber should be able to sit down part of the game and let the guys play without foot sliding up and down the court. If their style isn't that complicated then are they recruiting dumb players? However, I totally agree that it's the coaches' call and Trice hasn't earned the PT.

I don't believe our staff is unique in this either. This behavior is exhibited by most coaches night after night. As a referee, I see this every night as well. The team brings the ball down against the same defense and runs the play and every time runs it wrong regardless of what they do. It would sure be frustrating for me as a player to do it wrong EVERY time but if someone slops in a lucky make off busting the play, it's a good play.

[tmcats]

d.j. johnson shot free throws at .510 as a sophomore and .700 as a senior. it can be taught.

and i've seen many juco guys in snyder's program that didn't contribute much until seniors.

[Gorhoops]

Gor, I agree with Jax that it seems to me that this staff does try to make everything more complicated. At some point in time Weber should be able to sit down part of the game and let the guys play without foot sliding up and down the court. If their style isn't that complicated then are they recruiting dumb players? However, I totally agree that it's the coaches' call and Trice hasn't earned the PT.

I don't believe our staff is unique in this either. This behavior is exhibited by most coaches night after night. As a referee, I see this every night as well. The team brings the ball down against the same defense and runs the play and every time runs it wrong regardless of what they do. It would sure be frustrating for me as a player to do it wrong EVERY time but if someone slops in a lucky make off busting the play, it's a good play.

Are they trying to make it complicated, or do they just know what it takes to be successful when you don't have a bunch of 1 and done guys?? Coach K is supposed to be the greatest ever, and last year with a mini NBA team he basically just had to go 2-3 zone and hope they could out-talent and out-score the other team, and that got them ousted in the Elite 8, with a bunch of NBA players on the floor. Every year Self has guys considered 1 and done's like Grimes, Diallo, Selby, Alexander, and they just don't live up because he expects certain things.

I disagree completely with those that say the coaches should dumb down the defense so that players can easily adapt. Duke looked horrible on defense last night with a bunch of NBA guys, just gave up layup after layup because no matter how talented you are, if you are not 100% on the same page defensively, you will struggle.

I do not believe that any coach at KSU should ever try to make it easier just so that guys can get on the floor sooner because we will never have the offensive talent to out-score people, at least not 9 out of 10 years.

My point is simply, in a year when we are 20-6 and are leading the Big 12 with 5 games to play, are people seriously going to argue that the coaches need to dumb down the defense so that a guy like Austin Trice gets more minutes??? Seriously?? Come on. You do what you have to do to win.