It's time to play for the future

COTY Jerome Tang and his 2023 Elite Eight Cats
WIldWIllieCat
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Re: It's time to play for the future

Post by WIldWIllieCat » December 8th, 2019, 10:01 am

Puffdad wrote:
December 8th, 2019, 1:56 am
The freshmen will be getting all the experience they need or want.
This is precisely correct.

bigpurpleman
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Post by bigpurpleman » December 8th, 2019, 10:04 am

Our upperclassmen are role players coming off the bench for any other D1 team.

WIldWIllieCat
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Post by WIldWIllieCat » December 8th, 2019, 10:05 am

Definitely not going into who's "smarter" KITN, and I'm fine with the freshman earning more minutes. You are absolutely correct about "empty" minutes though. I just can't think of a way for a coach to have his players quit on him faster than if he quits on them.

ToledoCat#2
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Post by ToledoCat#2 » December 8th, 2019, 10:15 am

Every game is playing for the future. Last year this board was a wreck of pessimism. After the start of conf, the world was ending. Yet, we co-shared the B12 championship and had a long run in the Big Dance. For gosh sake, let's give this team a little slack. It will get better. How much, so? We'll find out.

hilltopwildcat
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Post by hilltopwildcat » December 8th, 2019, 9:57 pm

ToledoCat#2 wrote:
December 8th, 2019, 10:15 am
Every game is playing for the future. Last year this board was a wreck of pessimism. After the start of conf, the world was ending. Yet, we co-shared the B12 championship and had a long run in the Big Dance. For gosh sake, let's give this team a little slack. It will get better. How much, so? We'll find out.
Excuse me but we lost our opening round NCAA game as a 4 seed (again) in 2019.

Gorhoops
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Post by Gorhoops » December 9th, 2019, 9:24 am

A really good coach will just continue to build this team for THIS team. He will not just tank this season in hopes that it will help in the future. The coaches will continue to work every day to make this team better and will continue every day to make each player better and will continue to try and win every game and will continue to do what they think is best for THIS team.

As puff said, the freshman are going to get all the experience that they need. It is not as easy as "we suck so just play the young guys" as that can actually be a negative for the young guys. For some young guys that may be okay, but for others, they need to see how a motivated X Sneed prepares day in and day out. They need to see how veteran players work and prepare and handle adversity, and all of those other things.

I also agree with the poster that said these freshman aren't ready to play that many minutes with huge roles. Their roles can increase as the year goes on, but beating them into the ground physically and with their confidence is not a great plan either. Plus, even with these freshman and next years group coming in, we will need help next year from Carti and Levi or whoever. You need some veterans.

xtrawildcat
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Post by xtrawildcat » December 9th, 2019, 10:13 am

We went over all of this last year. I don't know how this team will turn out but I would suggest just as much patience as last year will be required by fans.

1. Last year we were shooting 28% from three in non con games. This year we are shooting .295 from three. If we shoot 29% from three the rest of the year, you are correct we will have a bad year.

2. Diarra is a .386 career shooter from three. Currently shooting 21%. If Diarra shoots 21% the rest of the year, you are correct we will have a bad year. He is playing a differrent role this year but most of the threes he are taking are open. The fact he is struggling at the line shows he is in a slump. We should all be hoping he comes out of it just like Kam did last year about this time. IE, remember Kam having to make 5 out of 7 threes to get us a 1 point win against Georgia State last year.

3. IMO, we are struggling on some aspects of our defense due to the freshmen, Sloan and guys like Shaun Williams are having some issues on positioning. If they don't improve on defense, we will continue to see more open shots than we like. But at the same time, we are turning teams over at a high rate. For example, we had 10 turnovers against Marquette and 10 steals. Most nights that will get you a win if you make some shots.

4. Our offense against Marguette was actually good except for not making close shots at the rim in the first half and not making free throws. We ran and got open shots in transition and also when we ran half court offense. Just didn't make enough of them.

IStillLikeHarv
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Post by IStillLikeHarv » December 9th, 2019, 10:45 am

Not counting McAtee (I presume no one is asking to up his minutes), this team has 10 scholarship players who have been available to play at some point in this season. The total minutes per game for the 6 returning players adds up to 136 mpg. The total minutes per game for the 4 new players adds up to 87 mpg. The new players make up 40% of the available players on the roster, and they are playing 39% of the minutes for which they have been available to play.

The new players are already playing a major chunk of the minutes available. Right now that is reduced because the best new player, who was averaging 29.7 mpg, is out with an injury. Trying to play these players more than they are already playing makes no sense given they are still trying to learn the system in many cases. This team is already in "full transition mode" because some of the best players are among the 4 new players. Indeed, the loss of Murphy is a big part of why the team is 5-3 instead of 6-2 or better. You have to let the young man's knee heal no matter how much he wants to play, which he surely does.

Sure it's frustrating, but this was always going to be a team in transition. Shockingly, losing those three seniors (to the NBA/G league/ Euro pro team) means there will be many bumps and bruises working new players into the line-up this season. The fact that the best of the new guys (so far) went down with a knee injury just makes it tougher. KSU was undefeated with Murphy in the line-up.

Gorhoops
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Post by Gorhoops » December 9th, 2019, 11:02 am

Again, things are never as good or as bad as they seem. Honestly, a weirdly terrible night at the FT line cost us the Pitt game. We make even 50% and we win that game. Then we probably lose to Northwestern and then to Marquette and are we really freaking out all that much at this point?

pulitzerdave
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Post by pulitzerdave » December 9th, 2019, 12:45 pm

Play the season out. Let the freshmen grow. Hope that the veterans show more leadership. Hope that we shoot the 3-ball better. Hope that we start making free throws. Expect that our offense will show more efficiency ... yes, all of that.

But at what point in the season to we stop with all of the excuses? At what point are we not a "new" team anymore? At what point do we give the freshmen a pass because of inexperience? At what point do we not lean on the Montavious Murphy crutch, as a reason for our failures? At what point do we just admit that this basketball team may not be very good, and just let them play. Sometimes teams jell, and sometimes they don't. Sometimes the parts fit, and sometimes they don't.

So let the season play out. It's Bruce Weber's job to figure it out. Down years happen.

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