Interesting comment by Weber on Kaosi in press conference

Discussion related to the K-State men's basketball team
wild@nite
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Re: Interesting comment by Weber on Kaosi in press conference

Post by wild@nite » January 30th, 2020, 1:22 pm

tmcats wrote:
January 30th, 2020, 1:02 pm
yep, and coaching wake level talent versus adidas level is different as well.
If so, why aren't KU's bigs as good as they were when he was there? I mean if it's Adidas and not Danny, why has their big play diminished? Go ahead, explain all of your wisdom.
Please tell me what you know about post coaching. What, exactly, do you know about Danny Manning's coaching ability? I'm betting zero, so I'll chalk it up to another day that you just want to play antagonist out of boredom.
Last edited by wild@nite on January 30th, 2020, 1:28 pm, edited 2 times in total.

Gorhoops
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Post by Gorhoops » January 30th, 2020, 1:22 pm

wild@nite wrote:
January 30th, 2020, 12:25 pm
Ok, I'm good with disagreeing on this. I know from experience that players respond differently to different coaches. I think Mak would absolutely be better under Danny Manning. He would most certainly learn more than a drop step. A good post coach would implement an up and under, a jump hook, a quick spin, Sikma move, face up and attack, or perhaps even a fade since he's only 6'8". Not to say he could learn all of these, but maybe develop 1 or 2. Nope. No signature move at all. No counter move at all. Nothing, in 3 years for him or Stockard, but we're not going to agree, obviously.

Also, referencing your post above. Brad Korn did not work with Gip and maybe one year with DJ, maybe. He doesn't get credit for them improving. 1 guy since Korn has arrived as the big coach has gotten better and I'll say it til I'm blue, that guy was gonna get better regardless because he had "it". Development is a huge part of coaching and if you can't do that then you better out recruit people. Oh.... We're not doing that either in this department.

We are doing well with guards and I 100% believe that Weber needs to address this weak part of the program.



Ok, honest question, in college basketball games today, how many up and under's do you see? How many jump hooks? how many Sikma's or even fade-aways?? I will give that I see quick spins more, and maybe occasionally a guy will face a guy up, bang into him and spin for a layup. I might see that once or maybe twice a game from someone really good,but honestly, we are in the world of the dribble drive offense where coaches have done the research and the analytics that say it is a waste of time to teach post moves because it is too dang hard to score over a guy in the post, especially with guards digging, etc. Today's post players are more schooled to find open area's off the drive and catch and finish. This isn't great for Mak because his hands are so bad.

I also never said Korn developed those other guys, in basketball I tend to think he is teaching the Bigs what Coach Weber wants him to teach the Bigs. When I say they developed DJ and Gip, I mean this staff in particular.

I have no clue if Brad Korn is worth a darn or not, but I am also not going to judge him because he has only been the Bigs coach for a what, 3 years, and he has not had but one guy that had "it" as you say.

By the way, when you said Wade had "it," you pretty much made my point for me. If guys don't have some intangibles, forget it.

wild@nite
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Post by wild@nite » January 30th, 2020, 1:27 pm

Gorhoops wrote:
January 30th, 2020, 1:22 pm
wild@nite wrote:
January 30th, 2020, 12:25 pm
Ok, I'm good with disagreeing on this. I know from experience that players respond differently to different coaches. I think Mak would absolutely be better under Danny Manning. He would most certainly learn more than a drop step. A good post coach would implement an up and under, a jump hook, a quick spin, Sikma move, face up and attack, or perhaps even a fade since he's only 6'8". Not to say he could learn all of these, but maybe develop 1 or 2. Nope. No signature move at all. No counter move at all. Nothing, in 3 years for him or Stockard, but we're not going to agree, obviously.

Also, referencing your post above. Brad Korn did not work with Gip and maybe one year with DJ, maybe. He doesn't get credit for them improving. 1 guy since Korn has arrived as the big coach has gotten better and I'll say it til I'm blue, that guy was gonna get better regardless because he had "it". Development is a huge part of coaching and if you can't do that then you better out recruit people. Oh.... We're not doing that either in this department.

We are doing well with guards and I 100% believe that Weber needs to address this weak part of the program.



Ok, honest question, in college basketball games today, how many up and under's do you see? How many jump hooks? how many Sikma's or even fade-aways?? I will give that I see quick spins more, and maybe occasionally a guy will face a guy up, bang into him and spin for a layup. I might see that once or maybe twice a game from someone really good,but honestly, we are in the world of the dribble drive offense where coaches have done the research and the analytics that say it is a waste of time to teach post moves because it is too dang hard to score over a guy in the post, especially with guards digging, etc. Today's post players are more schooled to find open area's off the drive and catch and finish. This isn't great for Mak because his hands are so bad.

I also never said Korn developed those other guys, in basketball I tend to think he is teaching the Bigs what Coach Weber wants him to teach the Bigs. When I say they developed DJ and Gip, I mean this staff in particular.

I have no clue if Brad Korn is worth a darn or not, but I am also not going to judge him because he has only been the Bigs coach for a what, 3 years, and he has not had but one guy that had "it" as you say.

By the way, when you said Wade had "it," you pretty much made my point for me. If guys don't have some intangibles, forget it.
I'll answer your first question. Not enough. The jump hook is way underused, as is the Sikma. Reversing for a jumper or ripping and attacking is a helluva weapon for a 6'9" kid. Maybe it's not all Korn, but it's certainly a weak area. The rest has been debated enough. We disagree on the issue.

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Post by tmcats » January 30th, 2020, 1:45 pm

wild@nite wrote:
January 30th, 2020, 1:22 pm
tmcats wrote:
January 30th, 2020, 1:02 pm
yep, and coaching wake level talent versus adidas level is different as well.
If so, why aren't KU's bigs as good as they were when he was there? I mean if it's Adidas and not Danny, why has their big play diminished? Go ahead, explain all of your wisdom.
Please tell me what you know about post coaching. What, exactly, do you know about Danny Manning's coaching ability? I'm betting zero, so I'll chalk it up to another day that you just want to play antagonist out of boredom.
dok could be b12 poy and an all-american.
"There ain't anybody stoppin' our ass!" CK

learnin
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Post by learnin » January 30th, 2020, 1:49 pm

wild@nite wrote:
January 30th, 2020, 12:37 pm
Danny Manning.... KU"s posts have been pretty pedestrian since he left the "big" position. Not a coincidence. He was a good post recruiter and teacher. Not such a great head coach, but if you paid attention, there are many coaches who are masters at a specific craft and struggle in the head position.
Perhaps Manning’s success at KU had more to do with the talent level at KU?

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Post by learnin » January 30th, 2020, 1:52 pm

wild@nite wrote:
January 30th, 2020, 1:22 pm
tmcats wrote:
January 30th, 2020, 1:02 pm
yep, and coaching wake level talent versus adidas level is different as well.
If so, why aren't KU's bigs as good as they were when he was there? I mean if it's Adidas and not Danny, why has their big play diminished? Go ahead, explain all of your wisdom.
Please tell me what you know about post coaching. What, exactly, do you know about Danny Manning's coaching ability? I'm betting zero, so I'll chalk it up to another day that you just want to play antagonist out of boredom.
I’d say the talent level has gone down, somewhat, at KU, since all the scandals that have surrounded the program over the last 5 years or longer

learnin
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Post by learnin » January 30th, 2020, 1:54 pm

If I was a big today, in the college game, I’d practice the heck out of a jump hook

Gorhoops
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Post by Gorhoops » January 30th, 2020, 1:55 pm

wild@nite wrote:
January 30th, 2020, 1:27 pm
Gorhoops wrote:
January 30th, 2020, 1:22 pm





Ok, honest question, in college basketball games today, how many up and under's do you see? How many jump hooks? how many Sikma's or even fade-aways?? I will give that I see quick spins more, and maybe occasionally a guy will face a guy up, bang into him and spin for a layup. I might see that once or maybe twice a game from someone really good,but honestly, we are in the world of the dribble drive offense where coaches have done the research and the analytics that say it is a waste of time to teach post moves because it is too dang hard to score over a guy in the post, especially with guards digging, etc. Today's post players are more schooled to find open area's off the drive and catch and finish. This isn't great for Mak because his hands are so bad.

I also never said Korn developed those other guys, in basketball I tend to think he is teaching the Bigs what Coach Weber wants him to teach the Bigs. When I say they developed DJ and Gip, I mean this staff in particular.

I have no clue if Brad Korn is worth a darn or not, but I am also not going to judge him because he has only been the Bigs coach for a what, 3 years, and he has not had but one guy that had "it" as you say.

By the way, when you said Wade had "it," you pretty much made my point for me. If guys don't have some intangibles, forget it.
I'll answer your first question. Not enough. The jump hook is way underused, as is the Sikma. Reversing for a jumper or ripping and attacking is a helluva weapon for a 6'9" kid. Maybe it's not all Korn, but it's certainly a weak area. The rest has been debated enough. We disagree on the issue.



I will agree with you here, especially about the jump hook. Now, every now and again you see a guy with a good one, but not many.

By the way wild, I hope you aren't taking our discussion as me being a jack, I'm loving this discussion, my only preference would be that we were sitting in front of a white board with a computer loaded full of film to watch. I love basketball discussion, especially with people that know basketball. Thank you for that. Agree or disagree, it is a great discussion.

wild@nite
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Post by wild@nite » January 30th, 2020, 1:56 pm

tmcats wrote:
January 30th, 2020, 1:45 pm
wild@nite wrote:
January 30th, 2020, 1:22 pm


If so, why aren't KU's bigs as good as they were when he was there? I mean if it's Adidas and not Danny, why has their big play diminished? Go ahead, explain all of your wisdom.
Please tell me what you know about post coaching. What, exactly, do you know about Danny Manning's coaching ability? I'm betting zero, so I'll chalk it up to another day that you just want to play antagonist out of boredom.
dok could be b12 poy and an all-american.
As I thought. Zero knowledge of either.

wild@nite
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Post by wild@nite » January 30th, 2020, 1:59 pm

Gorhoops wrote:
January 30th, 2020, 1:55 pm
wild@nite wrote:
January 30th, 2020, 1:27 pm


I'll answer your first question. Not enough. The jump hook is way underused, as is the Sikma. Reversing for a jumper or ripping and attacking is a helluva weapon for a 6'9" kid. Maybe it's not all Korn, but it's certainly a weak area. The rest has been debated enough. We disagree on the issue.



I will agree with you here, especially about the jump hook. Now, every now and again you see a guy with a good one, but not many.

By the way wild, I hope you aren't taking our discussion as me being a jack, I'm loving this discussion, my only preference would be that we were sitting in front of a white board with a computer loaded full of film to watch. I love basketball discussion, especially with people that know basketball. Thank you for that. Agree or disagree, it is a great discussion.
Heck no. I appreciate your "knowledge based" discussion as opposed to a couple on here who either feel that they 1. have to be an antagonist just because and 2. have to defend everything Weber just because. I have much more respect when someone's views aren't the daily status quo.

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