I hate bye weeks. Are we getting better from here on????????????

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wild@nite
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Re: I hate bye weeks. Are we getting better from here on????????????

Post by wild@nite » October 15th, 2019, 11:13 am

csteel25 wrote:
October 15th, 2019, 9:03 am
I feel good about Klieman as well. Also, if forced to choose, would rather have a solid DC first, than solid OC. Snyder had better defenses than offenses in the early years; and that worked out pretty well eventually. We have a true home field advantage at K-State that rivals almost anyone and compliments a great defense.
Agreed except for the home field. It has gotten a bit too comfortable outside of the student section, imo. Could be so much louder.

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Post by KsJoey » October 15th, 2019, 11:38 am

How are you guys sold on "Recruiting Abilities"? To me, that would mean, he's excelling at recruiting and has a strong class when compared to others. I like that Klieman went out and got committments early. And I like that he's letting there be more exposure in the program, which also helps recruiting. But on paper, we are currently ranked #8 in the Big12, and #46 in the country, avg .8450 recruit.

Compared to the past 5 years
2019: 9th, 62nd, avg .8397
2018: 9th, 66th, avg .8375
2017: 9th, 61st, avg .8333
2016: 10th, 72nd, avg .8208
2015: 8th, 54th, avg .8339

It's an improvement yes, and the class isn't over. But for me, I feel like Kliemans recruiting has been average at best. He also missed out on most of the top KS recruits for 2020. He's been slightly better than Snyder who we are comparing too.. but Snyder was a poor recruiter and very low benchmark to beat... close to the lowest in P5. I realize we aren't going to get the big recruits that a lot programs are going to get, but I still feel like there's a lot to sell a recruit to come to Manhattan. I also realize that Klieman needs more than a few months to create relationships with these guys, so that's understandable. I just hope 2021 can become an even better class.

I know you can't compare sports as apples to apples, but you can compare what it's like to recruit to Manhattan with basketball, and Bruce has found a way to get a bigtime class. #10 in the nation right now, and will probably finish in the Top 20. I know he can't do that every year, but truth is, you have to create pipelines where these kids are at, and figure out how to sell KState to them.

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Post by KsJoey » October 15th, 2019, 12:56 pm

csteel25 wrote:
October 15th, 2019, 12:50 pm
KSJoey - valid points. But he got a late start, managed to grab a bunch of xfers to address an empty backfield...and the young RB's/WR's he brought in seem to be the most athletic on the team.
I agree, he done what he's needed to do in the short time. I just think he still has a lot to prove on the recruiting end to show that he excels at it or for myself to be sold on him as a recruiter.. that's all. Recruiting was the biggest factor I was concerned about with the Klieman hire.

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Post by hilltopwildcat » October 15th, 2019, 3:55 pm

wild@nite wrote:
October 15th, 2019, 11:13 am
csteel25 wrote:
October 15th, 2019, 9:03 am
I feel good about Klieman as well. Also, if forced to choose, would rather have a solid DC first, than solid OC. Snyder had better defenses than offenses in the early years; and that worked out pretty well eventually. We have a true home field advantage at K-State that rivals almost anyone and compliments a great defense.
Agreed except for the home field. It has gotten a bit too comfortable outside of the student section, imo. Could be so much louder.
2/3 leave at half regardless of what is taking place on the field. Sad.

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Post by hilltopwildcat » October 15th, 2019, 3:55 pm

KsJoey wrote:
October 15th, 2019, 12:56 pm
csteel25 wrote:
October 15th, 2019, 12:50 pm
KSJoey - valid points. But he got a late start, managed to grab a bunch of xfers to address an empty backfield...and the young RB's/WR's he brought in seem to be the most athletic on the team.
I agree, he done what he's needed to do in the short time. I just think he still has a lot to prove on the recruiting end to show that he excels at it or for myself to be sold on him as a recruiter.. that's all. Recruiting was the biggest factor I was concerned about with the Klieman hire.
I was concerned about recruiting with any of the candidates that were mentioned.

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Post by tmcats » October 15th, 2019, 4:00 pm

north texas is 2-4.
Why is there something rather than nothing?

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Post by KsJoey » October 15th, 2019, 4:05 pm

hilltopwildcat wrote:
October 15th, 2019, 3:55 pm
KsJoey wrote:
October 15th, 2019, 12:56 pm


I agree, he done what he's needed to do in the short time. I just think he still has a lot to prove on the recruiting end to show that he excels at it or for myself to be sold on him as a recruiter.. that's all. Recruiting was the biggest factor I was concerned about with the Klieman hire.
I was concerned about recruiting with any of the candidates that were mentioned.
True. I think what's just as important(maybe even more important), is who the assistant coaches are, as they do a bulk of the recruiting. What recruiting ties do they have?..Is it an area we typically recruit from?.. etc. I think some assistant coaches on Kliemans staff are definitely proving their worth more(in terms of recruiting) than others. Hopefully Klieman takes note and continues to improve the staff every year.

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Post by AJcat7755 » October 15th, 2019, 5:04 pm

KsJoey wrote:
October 15th, 2019, 11:38 am
How are you guys sold on "Recruiting Abilities"? To me, that would mean, he's excelling at recruiting and has a strong class when compared to others. I like that Klieman went out and got committments early. And I like that he's letting there be more exposure in the program, which also helps recruiting. But on paper, we are currently ranked #8 in the Big12, and #46 in the country, avg .8450 recruit.

Compared to the past 5 years
2019: 9th, 62nd, avg .8397
2018: 9th, 66th, avg .8375
2017: 9th, 61st, avg .8333
2016: 10th, 72nd, avg .8208
2015: 8th, 54th, avg .8339

It's an improvement yes, and the class isn't over. But for me, I feel like Kliemans recruiting has been average at best. He also missed out on most of the top KS recruits for 2020. He's been slightly better than Snyder who we are comparing too.. but Snyder was a poor recruiter and very low benchmark to beat... close to the lowest in P5. I realize we aren't going to get the big recruits that a lot programs are going to get, but I still feel like there's a lot to sell a recruit to come to Manhattan. I also realize that Klieman needs more than a few months to create relationships with these guys, so that's understandable. I just hope 2021 can become an even better class.

I know you can't compare sports as apples to apples, but you can compare what it's like to recruit to Manhattan with basketball, and Bruce has found a way to get a bigtime class. #10 in the nation right now, and will probably finish in the Top 20. I know he can't do that every year, but truth is, you have to create pipelines where these kids are at, and figure out how to sell KState to them.
You can't really count the 2019 class. It takes time to build relationships with HS players, and coming in with a short time frame makes it hard to get a good class. CK wasn't going to come in and nab all the KS players without having a previous relationship. Just like with many fans taking the wait and see approach, so are recruits. KSU wasn't getting these top KS players in the past either, so it's nothing new right now. And KU isn't breaking into them either. CK even got recruits out of Lawrence.

There are a lot of positive signs so far.

Average is more important to look at instead of overall class rank because class ranks can be skewed due to # of recruits as well. In other words, would you rather have 25 bad players, or 20 better players? Even with the short time in the 2019 class, that was a higher average then in several past years.

Look at the 2020 class so far, it's average is 84.50. If that holds, that is the highest average since 247sports was tracking on it back to 2002. That is only with 18 members, when they want to get 25+ if possible. If that happens the class will end up in the 45-55 nationally range. Would that not be improvement?

The staff is doing well in Texas, which should be the biggest state for recruiting each class.

They are beating out other P5 schools for recruits, and not just a handful of G5 schools.

They have signed a QB in every class so far. How many times have fans griped about this not happening?

They might be able to flip some 2020 verbals away from P5 schools.

They are recruiting throughout the season and are recruiting classes beyond the current one. They are getting classes filled earlier, instead of getting them after the season.

I have seem rumors that there could be at least 1 commitment this weekend. Could be either the 2020 or 2021 class. If it's 2021, how many times in the past was a recruited committed 2 classes out?

In 2021, to show a bigger jump, then need to nab a top 5 KS kid, get a 4* player, finish in the top 50 nationally and top 6 of the Big 12 and continue to improve the class average.

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Post by AJcat7755 » October 15th, 2019, 5:30 pm

tmcats wrote:
October 15th, 2019, 4:00 pm
north texas is 2-4.
Despite returning their QB, they offense is worse then last year. A key reason why is the OC, Graham Harrell, left for USC. Harrell was one many were wanting to take over had Littrell left and probably for good reason. Littrell may have slowed down his ascent to the P5 ranks by not taking a job last year when/if he had the chance.

Now their schedule does get easier from here on out, and I would think they will be favored in 4 of the 6 remaining games. Probably finish 6-6 or 7-5 and go to some low bowl game. 4 bowl games in 4 years at UNT is still a good accomplishment, but not really building off back to back 9 win years.

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Post by Hypeman » October 15th, 2019, 8:05 pm

hilltopwildcat wrote:
October 15th, 2019, 3:55 pm
wild@nite wrote:
October 15th, 2019, 11:13 am


Agreed except for the home field. It has gotten a bit too comfortable outside of the student section, imo. Could be so much louder.
2/3 leave at half regardless of what is taking place on the field. Sad.
KSU has priced the average Joe from the sports venues. All you have at the games is wealthy old people. Doesn’t make for a loud and nasty crowd.

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