How did we get to this place?

Welcome Chris Klieman to K-State!
Zoltar
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How did we get to this place?

Post by Zoltar » July 22nd, 2019, 8:50 pm

I am not looking for coach bashing or excuses but I would like to know how the program got into such a low place that with a new coach with several FCS titles can come into a program and we simply expect a 6-6 season is great, but be ready for a step back because we are a shallow team.

I will admit that I don't follow recruiting much at all and am not familiar with what we lost from the team with the coaching change. Maybe it is my fault for just coming to expect more than this and I missed the forest for all the trees.

Did we just not recruit because we were not sure who would be the coach moving forward? How did we slip back to being a lower-tier program? Maybe we have been for a while and I just did not want to admit it. Was it my view through the purple shaded glasses I had on?

Again, I am not looking for anyone to blame anyone. Just point me in the right direction.
Win the dang day!

hilltopwildcat
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Post by hilltopwildcat » July 22nd, 2019, 9:02 pm

Some schools moved into the 21st century while we chose to remain the 1990's.

wild@nite
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Pick 'Em

Post by wild@nite » July 22nd, 2019, 9:13 pm

First of all, one bad year does not make us a lower tier program, however, I believe we were headed there. The staff was too rigid as far as subtle changes, imo, and we're not real motivated or passionate recruiters, except 2 of them. That, and the yearly decision period by Bill was definitely hurting recruiting.

My opinions.

I expect 7-5 seasons, minimum, all of the time, but I'm also realistic about it. When you lack depth at several positions, 6-6 is about right. Don't panic. If CK's staff can recruit this efficiently with barely stepping foot in Manhattan, imagine what he can sell with a passionate fanbase rocking the Bill. I expect him to actually use that tool more than LHCBS.

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Post by Tbonespop » July 22nd, 2019, 9:52 pm

Too many coaches that came from within KSU and not enough outside influence from other quality coaching staffs. This means limited exposure to other quality programs, thus the only thing being brought to the table came from within - mainly Bill Snyder. Couple that with Snyder being extremely set in his ways and unwilling to listen to others input, and you have where we were. Dickey was an example of what happens when you can find a quality coach outside the program. He was a bright spot on the staff. Both the offensive and defensive systems Snyder was running needed a face lift. With all due respect (and there is a lot of respect), it was time. We're in a completely new book now, not just a new chapter.

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Post by katlander » July 23rd, 2019, 12:45 am

Yep, your on it again T-bone. Loved Bill. Wasn't real happy with how it ended and some of the disrespect. But all in all it was time. And I really like Klieman and the new regime. Seem like good solid guys who can recruit and coach.

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Post by iowa_wildcat » July 23rd, 2019, 6:20 am

I can tell you exactly what happened. Most of us have a voice between our ears that tells us when to retire. We can listen or we can ignore it and/or fight it. We reach a point in time when we realize that our business has changed but we are no longer willing to change ourselves. Sooner or later the little details and routines that worked for us so well in the past begin to work against us. We fall behind a little each day. This situation only occurs when one has taken total ownership of what they do. They are so focused they have no concept of what could be next in the grand scheme of life. Their outside interests are severely limited because of their lifelong passion for success.

I know! I retired over 4 years ago. The first 6 months were pure hell. My ego had been satisfied by my hard work and track record for many, many years. What was now left to make me feel like a useful, worthwhile human? It took a while but I am finally at peace just being an old retired hooter.

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Post by spot2180 » July 23rd, 2019, 7:02 am

HCCK can coach. I don't care what division you are in, winning championships is never easy. I don't think KSU is 'too big' for him. I don't think the 'P5' schools are doing anything different than the level he was at. I have no doubt he will fit in well with the existing players at KSU and the incoming players.

But there will be transition issues like any other place. KSU will miss a beat or two just because of completely new players at RB, WR, and LB. But I am not worried about it. HCCK was pretty decent at using 'lesser' talent to beat FBS schools on a regular basis.

I think the biggest concern I have is injuries and depth, but I expect the Cats to start strong. Where they finish, I don't know. HCCK knows how to win, and we need to allow him to coach. It is his team now.
'To be a leftist means that one has to ignore the obvious....Social justice, enviornmental justice, racial justice are all oxymorons. These kinds of adjectives for justice do not denote actual justice. Only justice is justice.'

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Post by KITNooga » July 23rd, 2019, 7:08 am

spot2180 wrote:
July 23rd, 2019, 7:02 am
But there will be transition issues like any other place. KSU will miss a beat or two just because of completely new players at RB, WR, and LB. But I am not worried about it. HCCK was pretty decent at using 'lesser' talent to beat FBS schools on a regular basis.

I think the biggest concern I have is injuries and depth, but I expect the Cats to start strong. Where they finish, I don't know. HCCK knows how to win, and we need to allow him to coach. It is his team now.
lesser talent and lesser depth. two areas where CK has shown ability to overcome. don't know what this year itself holds, but am quite optimistic for the here and now as well as coming years.

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Post by WIldWIllieCat » July 23rd, 2019, 7:42 am

I don't think anyone is saying that a 6-6 season is "great", nor do I think that anyone projecting .500 seasons as "great" from here on out.

So to answer the op's question simply....perspective. CK took the baton from a 5-7 program and is facing some serious challenges.

We'll see how it goes. Frankly I'm getting a little excited about the energy around the program, but results on the field as always will tell the tale.
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spot2180
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Post by spot2180 » July 23rd, 2019, 8:38 am

Getting existing players to 'buy in' is, I think, the hardest part. It will show early on. If they don't buy in, 5-7 would be a blessing.

5-7 might be seen as a transitional success. I think the program's energy is exciting as well.
'To be a leftist means that one has to ignore the obvious....Social justice, enviornmental justice, racial justice are all oxymorons. These kinds of adjectives for justice do not denote actual justice. Only justice is justice.'

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