As the head coach the buck stops with him. If the OC can't properly game plan then there needs to be a new OC. If this continues, both CM and CK will be looking for jobs.Kid In the Hall wrote: ↑November 26th, 2021, 7:01 pmKlieman is a defensive coach - always has and always will be. As much as we all might wish/hope he can "become involved" and magically fix the offense, it just doesn't work that way.outofstate wrote: ↑November 26th, 2021, 6:04 pmCK has mentioned poor play calling and offensive game plan the last two weeks. Apparently he isn't very involved with the offensive side of the ball.
This offense will succeed (or fail) largely based on the abilities of the offensive coordinator.
And, the reality for us is that we have an offensive coordinator who failed at his only other Power 5 job and, aside from that, toiled around in the I-AA ranks for the vast majority of his career. When nobody wants your OC - even as a position coach - that's a pretty good sign that they don't have the ability to compete at a high level. Messignham has shown he doesn't have that ability to be a D-I coach - even with a once-in-a-decade talent in Deuce Vaughn.
FIRE MESSINGHAM
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Re: FIRE MESSINGHAM
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In most organizations that is true that the buck stops with the HC. When our AD got his job because the school wanted to hire CK, the AD was automatically indebted to CK, so there isn't anyone to hold CK accountable. In our case I think the buck stops with GT, because he won't fire the guy that basically got him this job. That's why I did like how that search went down, or the HC search, which was a shame. We all knew that CK was our net HC when GT got hired. The new president need to hire his/her own AD to fix this mess. Maybe that'll force CK to fire Messingham since GT won't do it.outofstate wrote: ↑November 26th, 2021, 9:10 pmAs the head coach the buck stops with him. If the OC can't properly game plan then there needs to be a new OC. If this continues, both CM and CK will be looking for jobs.Kid In the Hall wrote: ↑November 26th, 2021, 7:01 pm
Klieman is a defensive coach - always has and always will be. As much as we all might wish/hope he can "become involved" and magically fix the offense, it just doesn't work that way.
This offense will succeed (or fail) largely based on the abilities of the offensive coordinator.
And, the reality for us is that we have an offensive coordinator who failed at his only other Power 5 job and, aside from that, toiled around in the I-AA ranks for the vast majority of his career. When nobody wants your OC - even as a position coach - that's a pretty good sign that they don't have the ability to compete at a high level. Messignham has shown he doesn't have that ability to be a D-I coach - even with a once-in-a-decade talent in Deuce Vaughn.
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This is from December 2, 2021. Nothing has changed.
https://www.heartlandcollegesports.com/ ... r-problem/
The leadership at K-State gave Courtney Messingham a year to figure things out, and nothing has changed.
https://www.heartlandcollegesports.com/ ... r-problem/
The leadership at K-State gave Courtney Messingham a year to figure things out, and nothing has changed.
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Yep, remember that Baylor game from last year. The end of the first half - 2:00 to play at near midfield and Courtney goes conservative. I figured that would come back to bite them, and sure enough it did. He hasn’t changed one bit, and apparently hasn’t been required to change his ways. Having him as OC at anything above high school level is ridiculous.PNW Cat wrote: ↑November 26th, 2021, 10:22 pmThis is from December 2, 2021. Nothing has changed.
https://www.heartlandcollegesports.com/ ... r-problem/
The leadership at K-State gave Courtney Messingham a year to figure things out, and nothing has changed.
As I’ve said before, I’m ok with a loss if everyone gave their best effort. But, I seldom come away from games thinking the coaching gave their best effort - particularly the offensive staff. If Courtney hasn’t changed yet, and Klieman hasn’t demanded change, the only thing left is to let him/them go.
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PNW Cat wrote: ↑November 26th, 2021, 10:22 pmThis is from December 2, 2020 (oops, edited to correct the year). Nothing has changed.
https://www.heartlandcollegesports.com/ ... r-problem/
The leadership at K-State gave Courtney Messingham a year to figure things out, and nothing has changed.
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Even 10 hours after, I’m still dumbfounded by what happened. I’m often hyperbolic but I don’t know if I’ve seen that bad of a half of playcalling in my entire life. You could literally close your eyes and pick a play AND be 10x better than that.
Here are some of the coaching malpractice:
1. Bombs to Landry Weber and Phillip Brooks - wtf?
2. Lining up in wildcat
3. Lining up in wildcat again
4. Not running your QB straight ahead on short yardage
5. Being completely unprepared to run a no huddle O
6. Not having a 2nd back ready
7. Throwing a bubble on 3rd and 2 when the box is light and a QB or RB run gets you an easy first
8. Running option on the last 4th down when your QB is the worst decision maker ever
Will was/is not good at all. But make no mistake, that game is a W, most likely comfortably, with 99.9% of OCs in FBS.
Here are some of the coaching malpractice:
1. Bombs to Landry Weber and Phillip Brooks - wtf?
2. Lining up in wildcat
3. Lining up in wildcat again
4. Not running your QB straight ahead on short yardage
5. Being completely unprepared to run a no huddle O
6. Not having a 2nd back ready
7. Throwing a bubble on 3rd and 2 when the box is light and a QB or RB run gets you an easy first
8. Running option on the last 4th down when your QB is the worst decision maker ever
Will was/is not good at all. But make no mistake, that game is a W, most likely comfortably, with 99.9% of OCs in FBS.
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Bumping this! This needs to be a 100 page. Lets keep it going.
Any word on Messingham getting fired yet?
EMAW